Exploration into Insight
Pupul Jayakar: I wonder whether we can talk about silence and how it is reached, or whether silence has many facets and forms. Whether there is only one silence which is absence of thought, or whether silence which arises through different experiences or different situations is different in nature, dimension and direction.
K: And whether there are different varieties of silence, which means different methods by which to arrive at silence, and is silence... what is the nature of silence. So, shall we go in that order first? Is there a right approach to silence - right in the sense - 'right', we'll put it in quotes. What do we mean by right?
PJ: Is there the one, or if all silences are of the same nature then there may be many approaches.
Questioner: You seem to be giving emphasis to the true approach rather than the nature of true silence. What is the distinction?
Q: Sir, simple thing, may be absurd, but when one does pranayama there's no conflict in it, but there is silence; it doesn't exhaust you. What is the nature of that silence?
Q: Sir, would you include the silence induced by nature to this list - drugs, breath.
PJ: But that is only nature. These others...
Q: That's the nature of disorder.
K: I am asking, sir - please follow what we have so far discussed: we started out with silence, what is the nature of silence; are there different varieties of silence, are there different approaches to silence. Pupul also said, what is the beginning of silence, the approach to silence? We said, perhaps there may be a right way - 'right' in quotes. And we said, let's find out. Any artificial means to bring about silence is not silence - any artificial means, we made that very clear, don't let's go back to that. If there is no artificial way then what is - is it possible to come upon silence naturally, without effort, without inducement, without direction, without artificial means. And in examining it, we said harmony. To that Pupul says, we don't know what this harmony is but what we do know is disorder. So let us put aside everything else and consider disorder, not what silence is. Therefore, a mind that is disordered enquires after silence. Silence then becomes the means of bringing about order, or escape from disorder. Silence then is imposed on disorder. As that gentleman said, impose it, or run away from disorder. We stop all that and say, why is there disorder? Is it possible to end disorder? Right? Oh lord.
PJ: I don't. I observe the nature of disorder. I don't look for the cause, I don't know the cause, I can never know the cause.
PJ: Then I'm bound to ask. It is the nature of the mind to ask.
PJ: The nature of the question needs answering. Look, sir, I am not talking - these steps we can discover, we needn't come to it by these steps.
PJ: But I thought it would be better to go step by step. Now I say there's an ending there. There may not be an ending. There is an ending there. I say there is an ending. To someone else there may not be an ending, but there is an ending. I say, what is the nature of this? Is this silence? Then I come back to my first question. Or is there an undercurrent still operating? You see, the (inaudible) of different qualities and natures and dimensions of silence. It means just this. The traditional outlook is the gap between two thoughts is silence.
PJ: We moved, Krishnaji, please, we have moved from silence, to harmony and we found that it was impossible to go into the nature of harmony without going into disorder.
Q: Of course it can be free, sir, it can be free of conflict, but the question which arises is what is the nature of that freedom from conflict?
Q: That's the question which I ask. What is the nature of this ending and what do we mean by total...
PJ: Seeing the nature of that, can the mind say, if it is conflict it is conflict?
PJ: Then its total nature undergoes...
